Results 1 to 51 of 51

Thread: Been eye balling poor mans E63

  1. #1
    Registered Member Style_Front's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Sacile, Italy
    Posts
    7,072
    vCash
    500

    Been eye balling poor mans E63

    CPO 2014 E550's are on Mercedes website for as low as $30k.

    4.6 turbo V8 instead of 5.5
    Both have forged rotating assemblies
    Both have nearly same transmission (E63 has clutch, E550 has TC)
    Both have identical bolt patterns. E63 turbos mount directly to the 4.6
    With a tune, intercooler pump and a pair of hand me down E63 turbos these cars are putting 600 to all 4 tires.

    Good idea? Terrible idea?

  2. #2
    SPECIAL DARK HOTCIVIC's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    KFC
    Posts
    23,690
    vCash
    3000
    Good idea - probably not
    Fun idea - absolutely
    Expensive idea - probably

    How many miles on these E550s you are seeing for $30k? I'd be afraid to own one outside of warranty, and if you start modifying things I doubt you're going to keep the warranty.

    If you have the funds to do it and it's not going to hurt your bank account if something breaks, I say go for it.

  3. #3
    Registered Member Style_Front's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Sacile, Italy
    Posts
    7,072
    vCash
    500
    The CPO cars are warrantied for 1 year. And I suppose I could hold off for that long before dumping the parts on it.

    Looking around online I can find a set of used M157 turbos for about 3-5k, intercooler pump about a 1k and the tune...well I really want AMS to do it which is approximately another 2-3k. I could take my time looking for the right turbos and launch for the install around warranty expiration time.

    The CPO cars seem to range from 12k miles (low $40's) to 55k miles for about $30k

  4. #4
    Registered Member Style_Front's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Sacile, Italy
    Posts
    7,072
    vCash
    500
    And while Mercedes is far from cheap to repair, at least the 550 doesn't have the usual AMG tax on absolutely everything. The drivetrain has been used in a number of chassis in moderate volume so costs to buy parts are not terrible.

    I still get mad when I think about the $500 water hose for the E55 I bought.

  5. #5

  6. #6
    Registered Member Style_Front's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Sacile, Italy
    Posts
    7,072
    vCash
    500
    I didn't say Radiator hose.

  7. #7
    Registered Member Style_Front's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Sacile, Italy
    Posts
    7,072
    vCash
    500
    Hang on, lemme see if I can find this little cocksucker

  8. #8
    What Would Oddjob Do? 5.0THIS's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Colorado
    Posts
    25,200
    vCash
    1943
    So you didn't learn your lesson the first time through with a used Benz. And then you want to modify it?

  9. #9
    Registered Member Style_Front's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Sacile, Italy
    Posts
    7,072
    vCash
    500
    http://www.pelicanparts.com/More_Inf...VSVSI=3890.htm

    It used to be $449 dollars, it has since been lowered. Also I was in Italy when it wore a hole in the line and they have the same price for parts except in euros.

  10. #10
    Registered Member Style_Front's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Sacile, Italy
    Posts
    7,072
    vCash
    500
    Quote Originally Posted by 5.0THIS View Post
    So you didn't learn your lesson the first time through with a used Benz. And then you want to modify it?
    What would you recommend?

  11. #11
    Registered Member Style_Front's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Sacile, Italy
    Posts
    7,072
    vCash
    500
    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	IMG_1849.GIF 
Views:	42 
Size:	4.6 KB 
ID:	27341

    Part number 11

  12. #12
    What Would Oddjob Do? 5.0THIS's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Colorado
    Posts
    25,200
    vCash
    1943
    Quote Originally Posted by Style_Front View Post
    What would you recommend?
    Not buying a used Mercedes benz to modify. And then whining about parts costs.

  13. #13
    Registered Member Style_Front's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Sacile, Italy
    Posts
    7,072
    vCash
    500
    Quote Originally Posted by 5.0THIS View Post
    Not buying a used Mercedes benz to modify. And then whining about parts costs.
    Eh, it's my destiny to be in some form of toxic relationship somewhere

  14. #14
    Registered Member speed_demon24's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    PC Florida
    Posts
    18,121
    vCash
    25
    Gamer IDs

    PSN ID: spddmn24
    Quote Originally Posted by Style_Front View Post
    The CPO cars are warrantied for 1 year. And I suppose I could hold off for that long before dumping the parts on it.

    Looking around online I can find a set of used M157 turbos for about 3-5k, intercooler pump about a 1k and the tune...well I really want AMS to do it which is approximately another 2-3k. I could take my time looking for the right turbos and launch for the install around warranty expiration time.

    The CPO cars seem to range from 12k miles (low $40's) to 55k miles for about $30k
    2-3k for a tune?

  15. #15
    Registered Member Style_Front's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Sacile, Italy
    Posts
    7,072
    vCash
    500
    Quote Originally Posted by speed_demon24 View Post
    2-3k for a tune?
    Yup!

  16. #16
    your mom savantard's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Sugar Land, TX
    Posts
    15,708
    vCash
    80
    Gamer IDs

    Gamertag: savantard
    Sounds risky, but the rewards would be pretty damn sweet. Really comes down to what you're willing to risk.

  17. #17
    Registered Member runningmole's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    San Diego, CA
    Posts
    11,765
    vCash
    955
    Quote Originally Posted by Style_Front View Post
    I didn't say Radiator hose.
    Quote Originally Posted by Style_Front View Post
    http://www.pelicanparts.com/More_Inf...VSVSI=3890.htm

    It used to be $449 dollars, it has since been lowered. Also I was in Italy when it wore a hole in the line and they have the same price for parts except in euros.
    I don't care.

  18. #18
    The Sax of Cars Anewconvert's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Raleigh, NC
    Posts
    14,054
    vCash
    1301
    Damn it. I didn't need this thought in my head

  19. #19
    underdog 4 lyfe ill deuce's Avatar

    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    atoka,tennessee
    Posts
    63,028
    vCash
    25
    i'd run away screaming from any high end used mercedes.

  20. #20
    No ragrets Tristan's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    In a van down by the river
    Posts
    76,106
    vCash
    1025
    Quote Originally Posted by Style_Front View Post
    Eh, it's my destiny to be in some form of toxic relationship somewhere

  21. #21
    I like to do the breaking in person LV2XLR8's Avatar

    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Recruiting
    Posts
    68,317
    vCash
    25
    Gamer IDs

    Gamertag: That LSU Guy
    I wouldn't do it.

  22. #22
    View is nice from up here silverSS's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    ATL
    Posts
    25,922
    vCash
    25
    2-3k for a tune.... there aren't enough s in the world to convey my feelings on that.
    Last edited by silverSS; 05-15-2017 at 08:39 PM.

  23. #23
    Registered Member

    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Posts
    23,607
    vCash
    25
    Quote Originally Posted by Style_Front View Post
    Eh, it's my destiny to be in some form of toxic relationship somewhere


    That's probably the funniest thing I'll read on the internet today.

  24. #24
    Starminator Wars 2: Judgement Force ScotWithOne_t's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Twin Cities, MN
    Posts
    23,853
    vCash
    1525
    You know it's a terrible idea, or you wouldn't be seeking approval from us.

  25. #25
    Coastal Elite Crew Rich_S's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Wherever I May Roam
    Posts
    84,660
    vCash
    750
    Quote Originally Posted by Style_Front View Post
    What would you recommend?
    2011-2012 Mustang GT with a TVS, exhaust, and tune.

  26. #26
    The Sax of Cars Anewconvert's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Raleigh, NC
    Posts
    14,054
    vCash
    1301
    Quote Originally Posted by Rich_S View Post
    2011-2012 Mustang GT with a TVS, exhaust, and tune.
    What is the reasonable limit on power through the driveline of a 2011-2012 GT?? Like "you are totally safe up to this point then things start getting hinky"

  27. #27
    Rise early. Work hard. STRIKE OIL! CT Morgan's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    DFW, TEXAS
    Posts
    57,574
    vCash
    1250
    Quote Originally Posted by Anewconvert View Post
    What is the reasonable limit on power through the driveline of a 2011-2012 GT?? Like "you are totally safe up to this point then things start getting hinky"
    The Ford Racing kit is set for 624 hp / 534 tq for the manual cars so as long as the car is in good running order then it should be good for at least that. I don't think FR offers anything for the auto cars of those years so I take that as a sign not to push those hard.

  28. #28
    Registered Member Style_Front's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Sacile, Italy
    Posts
    7,072
    vCash
    500
    Quote Originally Posted by Rich_S View Post
    2011-2012 Mustang GT with a TVS, exhaust, and tune.
    Id be more interested in a cts-v than a mustang. But the new 5 liter with 10-speed is slightly more tempting than the usual mustang.

    Main reason for the change is my E55 struggles to put power down with a high performance tire (which has shit life span) so I'm moving back to an AWD car.

  29. #29
    Registered Member Style_Front's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Sacile, Italy
    Posts
    7,072
    vCash
    500
    Quote Originally Posted by ScotWithOne_t View Post
    You know it's a terrible idea, or you wouldn't be seeking approval from us.
    I began making moves towards the E550 before posting this, I posted this for entertainment purposes.

    There's a lot of predictable outcomes when posting on both MBworld and LS2

  30. #30
    Registered Member Gravy Train's Avatar

    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    Plano, TX
    Posts
    10,490
    vCash
    506
    Quote Originally Posted by Style_Front View Post
    Id be more interested in a cts-v than a mustang. But the new 5 liter with 10-speed is slightly more tempting than the usual mustang.

    Main reason for the change is my E55 struggles to put power down with a high performance tire (which has shit life span) so I'm moving back to an AWD car.

    You should be looking into the C7 Audi S6. Parts are more expensive but like the Benzo, you can swap RS7 turbos over to the S6/S7 with a supporting tune. APR's OEM RS7 turbo upgrade is good for 634hp / 671 ft-# through the 7-speed DL501 DSG. You'll definitely need a DSG tune to go with that.

    It's exactly what I should have done from the start and will be onto soon.

  31. #31
    "C-c-c-c-ombo Breaker!!" jeeplaw's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Skara Brae
    Posts
    9,483
    vCash
    350
    Join the cts-v crew :doit:

  32. #32
    Registered Member Style_Front's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Sacile, Italy
    Posts
    7,072
    vCash
    500
    Quote Originally Posted by Gravy Train View Post
    You should be looking into the C7 Audi S6. Parts are more expensive but like the Benzo, you can swap RS7 turbos over to the S6/S7 with a supporting tune. APR's OEM RS7 turbo upgrade is good for 634hp / 671 ft-# through the 7-speed DL501 DSG. You'll definitely need a DSG tune to go with that.

    It's exactly what I should have done from the start and will be onto soon.
    I think that's a really great option as well, the main draw to the E550 is $10K less buy in for a CPO car, the transmission is also a basic automatic with rebuilds rated for 1000 ft/lbs from big names for $3-5k (the twin clutch costs would be astronomical to repair or upgrade) and lastly Mercedes had a LOT of M157 engines produced compared to RS7 so second hand turbos are in a lot more abundance.

  33. #33
    I'm flowin' prose Mike Hawk's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Tulsa
    Posts
    54,501
    vCash
    2241
    Cot dam that S6 is dam sexy. And so unassuming. With a tune / turbo upgrade no one would know you could wreck their shit.


    Never really cared for the hump on the S7

    $80k before TTL (Prestige, Sport, with upgraded wheels)
    Last edited by Mike Hawk; 06-02-2017 at 10:11 PM.

  34. #34
    Oh I think they like me Tunavelli's Avatar

    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Sussex, WI
    Posts
    27,898
    Blog Entries
    1
    vCash
    2025
    Gamer IDs

    PSN ID: Akunatun
    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Hawk View Post
    Cot dam that S6 is dam sexy. And so unassuming. With a tune / turbo upgrade no one would know you could wreck their shit.


    Never really cared for the hump on the S7

    $80k before TTL (Prestige, Sport, with upgraded wheels)
    I just saw one of those today in dark gray with black rims, looked mean as fuck. I used to think audis were boring but I appreciate their subtle styling a lot more now.

  35. #35
    Registered Member Gravy Train's Avatar

    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    Plano, TX
    Posts
    10,490
    vCash
    506
    Too bad the C7 is in its last production year with the 4.0t.

  36. #36
    Registered Member Style_Front's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Sacile, Italy
    Posts
    7,072
    vCash
    500
    Hmmm, it looks like the A8 has this same 4.0t and a ZF 8-speed. Stock the land yacht makes 0-60 in 3.9, tuned in 3.5, I sent a message asking APR if the kit you guys are referring to will fit

  37. #37
    Registered Member Style_Front's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Sacile, Italy
    Posts
    7,072
    vCash
    500
    Also somehow that car is rated 28mpg. It's quick and efficient for a 4600 lbs car

  38. #38
    Registered Member Style_Front's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Sacile, Italy
    Posts
    7,072
    vCash
    500
    Welp, APR doesn't offer a box tune for it and doesn't do custom tunes. Sent a message to Eurocharged

  39. #39
    Registered Member Gravy Train's Avatar

    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    Plano, TX
    Posts
    10,490
    vCash
    506
    Quote Originally Posted by Style_Front View Post
    Welp, APR doesn't offer a box tune for it and doesn't do custom tunes. Sent a message to Eurocharged
    Look up EPL, they have box codes and do custom tunes. They're just getting into the 4.0t platform.

    Edit:APR won't help you but they are working on ZF 8BP tunes.
    Last edited by Gravy Train; 06-18-2017 at 10:42 AM.

  40. #40
    Registered Member Style_Front's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Sacile, Italy
    Posts
    7,072
    vCash
    500
    I sent Tony from EPL a message on Facebook as well

  41. #41
    Registered Member Style_Front's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Sacile, Italy
    Posts
    7,072
    vCash
    500
    Tony is not interested.

  42. #42
    Registered Member Gravy Train's Avatar

    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    Plano, TX
    Posts
    10,490
    vCash
    506
    Strange, given the A8 4.0T is the same powertrain as the S6, but with the S8/RS7's ZF 8-speed auto.

    RSW might be able to shed more light on this, but I believe they use APR's tunes.
    https://redlinespeedworx.com/audi-s6...turbo-upgrade/

    You've probably already seen this, but the S8's long block and turbochargers are equivalent to the RS7's. Tune-only cars are trapping 128+.

  43. #43
    Registered Member Style_Front's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Sacile, Italy
    Posts
    7,072
    vCash
    500
    The part number for the transmission in the A8, S8 and RS7 is the same so it's all kind of odd that no one is messing with the A8. I asked Tony if a TCU swap might work, he said maybe, but for the most part every shop that's replied to me just seems disinterested in that platform.

  44. #44
    Registered Member Style_Front's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Sacile, Italy
    Posts
    7,072
    vCash
    500
    Welp, GIAC out of Irvine, Ca might do it. They are one of a few that can actually tune them. I think MTM in Germany, APR and GIAC are a few of the only guys who have actually cracked the Audi ECU's and can do something custom. So, if they agree here's what I'm looking at.

    A8 $35,000
    TTE800 turbo upgrades $3000
    GIAC custom tune $2-4000
    Turbo back downpipes $1-2000

    Waters are a bit uncharted, kinda, but not really, should be in the realm just north of 600whp on pump

  45. #45
    What Would Oddjob Do? 5.0THIS's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Colorado
    Posts
    25,200
    vCash
    1943
    Didnt you say the A8 uses the same turbos as an RS7? Those arent enough turbo to get you to your goals?

  46. #46
    Registered Member Style_Front's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Sacile, Italy
    Posts
    7,072
    vCash
    500
    Quote Originally Posted by 5.0THIS View Post
    Didnt you say the A8 uses the same turbos as an RS7? Those arent enough turbo to get you to your goals?
    In order of turbo bigness RS7, S8, A8

    All three of them use the same center section and housings but varying wheels/turbines. So you can send either of them to TTE and have them machined out to fit a slightly larger compressor/turbine (the slightness varying on which model you start with obviously). The RS7 turbos are "enough" for me, I'd be happy with a pair of them, but the TTE upgrade is half the cost so fuck it.

    It's about $6k for RS7 turbos or 2500 euro to have ze Germans switch out some stuffs.
    Last edited by Style_Front; 06-21-2017 at 09:01 AM.

  47. #47
    I'm flowin' prose Mike Hawk's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Tulsa
    Posts
    54,501
    vCash
    2241
    I'll have a DP on my R before you do all this Style

    Almost pulled the trigger on an AWE resonated dp with hjs cell cat (ie the good kind) since its one of the better dp and will sound stock with no drone. But cot dam, $1,285 smarts! Then another $1,075 for a eurodyne ecu and dsg tune.

    Last edited by Mike Hawk; 06-21-2017 at 09:25 AM.

  48. #48
    Registered Member Style_Front's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Sacile, Italy
    Posts
    7,072
    vCash
    500
    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Hawk View Post
    I'll have a DP on my R before you do all this Style

    Almost pulled the trigger on an AWE resonated dp with hjs cell cat (ie the good kind) since its one of the better dp and will sound stock with no drone. But cot dam, $1,285 smarts! Then another $1,075 for a eurodyne ecu and dsg tune.

    The APR stage 3 kit is just too perfect man. Rarely does a so well put together kit make it to the market like that. I would definitely bypass the small nik naks and just do a proper upgrade.

  49. #49
    I'm flowin' prose Mike Hawk's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Tulsa
    Posts
    54,501
    vCash
    2241
    There was a big thread on vortex on those kits blowing up...need to research some more if it's been fixed.

  50. #50
    Registered Member Gravy Train's Avatar

    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    Plano, TX
    Posts
    10,490
    vCash
    506
    Quote Originally Posted by Style_Front View Post
    here's what I'm looking at.

    A8 $35,000
    TTE800 turbo upgrades $3000
    GIAC custom tune $2-4000
    Turbo back downpipes $1-2000

    Waters are a bit uncharted, kinda, but not really, should be in the realm just north of 600whp on pump
    How do the costs and performance compare if you were to do the poor man's upgrade to a plasticky E550?

  51. #51
    Registered Member Style_Front's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Sacile, Italy
    Posts
    7,072
    vCash
    500
    Quote Originally Posted by Gravy Train View Post
    How do the costs and performance compare if you were to do the poor man's upgrade to a plasticky E550?
    Roughly the same, with less power. It really depends on the deals available at the time for the turbos. I've seen a pair of hand me down 63's going for a little shy of $4000. Downpipes are freakishly expensive like $2-4000, but tunes are available custom through a multitude of quality shops. The hardware is very simple but install on the E/CLS550 is far trickier since the motor has to be pulled to swap turbos. So labor difference there you could imagine the difference

    There's pros and cons to either setup. Major con for Merc = install, major con for Audi is very limited software support.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •